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Post by damianmagecraft on Dec 11, 2013 17:30:41 GMT
The best way for Palladium to survive and prosper (re-gain older or garner new gamers while maintaining the current player base) is to first print a collected rules only book (All the rules a huge rules encyclopedia if you will).
And while they are collecting all the rules into one source they should re-word the rules so that RAW more closely matches RAI.
This will update the rules without (as some think) invalidating existing material.
As the current print runs of core books (which would still be needed to run the settings) sell out either remove the rules from them and sell them as setting cores or just cut and paste the bare bones of the rules (I am conflicted as to which approach would be best).
From there I would say change product release announcements and goals to "we will produce one book every quarter in addition to the Rifters" and do not ever announce the titles of the books until after they have gone to the printer. (this one is wishful thinking I know).
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Post by ninjabunny on Dec 11, 2013 17:52:54 GMT
Those are logical changes that would work way better then doing nothing.
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Post by damianmagecraft on Dec 11, 2013 18:13:39 GMT
Those are logical changes that would work way better then doing nothing. The trick is getting a majority of the Hobby enthusiasts to agree these changes would help... |
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Post by Sci-Fi on Dec 11, 2013 19:22:28 GMT
Thing is, if past history and behavior is used to predict future behavior, a combined rule book like that would be a collection of already written rules, cut and pasted, ad hoc and in little logical fashion or order into a book.
That sounds pessimistic, but just pointing out, their past behavior points to that sort of thing.
I agree with the theory. It worked for White Wolf. I've even proposed this thing before. I just don't see them doing it. The self delusion from the top there is too strong. As has been brought up recently, Kevin's 'poll' stated (And got uproarious descent) That 90% think he's doing fine and keep on doing exactly what he was doing. The poll was wildly panned for being biased, as you can't get 9 out of 10 Roleplayers to agree that the sky is blue or water is wet. One of them is going to meow at you and some asshat is going to go into some psudoscientific explanation about how water is dry when it's frozen etc etc etc.
Still if Kevin is putting out official 'polls' where he says 90% of players say it's 100% fine as is, there's not going to be a change. In the same poll release he paints all critics as people who have never played the game and are just haters.
The doors almost closed a few years ago an a new edition or consolidated rule book never even approached the horizon. They were bailed out by fans giving them money. If that couldn't motivate them to innovate, I don't expect them to.
Being 100% honest, I thought they were going to close their doors forever before the Christmas before last. A one final blow out sale type thing. They surprised me. The insider stuff helped. They got influx of 40,000 and waited over a year to produce the work.(Half the work. we're still waiting on NG2) That didn't hurt. The Robotech thing surprised everyone, but they're late on delivery for that now and each day past Christmas will up the anger over those things. You think people were pissed when their $15 PDF was late? Wasn't the average on the robotech thing like $250? Whoo.
I personally stay out of the Robotech forums here and on the official page. Just no dog in the fight, but I see the spill over and apparently the Robotech guys are pretty animated, and that's just arguing over which version of Robotech is the best. Sitting on hundreds of their dollars with no product is going to ramp up FAST. I'm by far no expert, but I've been keeping an eye out. Anyone notice that 80%+ of the Minis for the Robotech thing aren't produced yet? The pics that people keep seeing over and over are the computer 3D models. They stated in a press release or in this month's rifter that they've not gone to production yet. The product was due out this month and most of the mini's haven't even been shown in real life work. Just computer models.
They better get on the ball or this Robotech thing that is being hearlded as what will keep Palladium afloat, may garner them huge huge negative press and end up being what kills them. RPG books being late, when they're ALWAYS late, to the point Defenders actually will accuse you of being stupid if you belive the lies as to release dates are one thing.
This robotech thing is another. They're not in too much danger yet. They're late, they're approaching the cliff at high speed and noone's on the break. If the Robotech game isn't out first quarter next year..... People are going to get vocal.
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Post by joshuagoliath on Dec 12, 2013 5:09:38 GMT
Well, I agree that a consolidated AND CLEANED UP core rules would definitely help. Sure as hell wouldn't hurt.
But, really, there are so many other problems that will one or two things actually be enough?
And, I have to agree with Sci-Fi. If we were to see a "consolidated" rule book, there would be nothing but cut and pastes. There would be no cleanup, no streamlining, etc. None of the errors would be fixed. None of the differences between settings would be clarified or solved. Hell, look at how many problems people find with RUE, and that was simply the ONE SETTING involved.
Honestly, I'm labelled as a "hater"- of KS. I think he is the core problem. Do I doubt the screams of "He's a great guy! I know him personally!"? Not at all. I'm sure he IS a great guy. He's definitely a creative genius. I think he just sucks royally at being an administrator and manager. I think he's more stubborn than a 75year old donkey that wants to stand there and block your path.
I think that deep down, when PB hit it's heyday in the 90s, he got overwhelmed, saw the glory, and is still stuck there. And that has blocked him from being able to see the faults he and his company have, and unable to grasp the fact that this is NOT the 90s, and is, in fact, a quite different world, with different expectations. And this is what has prevented PB from reclaiming a powerhouse seat.
Could he do something about release schedules? Yes. Could he do something about the settings that don't get any support? Yes. Could he do something about the typos and sloppy editing? Yes.
But, WILL he? Absolutely not. After all, he had a company that was #2 or 3 (depending on what materials you read) a couple of decades back, so obviously, he was doing something right!
I think the BEST possible way for PB to survive is to completely restructure how they operate day to day, KS to step from trying to run the company to being a creator (books!), and get an actual business manager in place. Stop hiring people who are "friends", and instead hire people who excel at specific jobs. Keep the fact of friendship and business separate. When they're friends, you accept them being "sick" and missing work 3 days a week every other week. When they're friends, you let them miss deadlines. When they're friends, you let them slack on their job because of reasons X, Y, and Z. When they're employees, you tell them "do your job, or I'll find someone who will at fifty cents an hour less".
Like I said- I don't doubt the "he's a GREAT GUY!" speeches. I just don't think he's a great MANAGER. If he was, we wouldn't have these issues.
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jorel
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Post by jorel on Dec 12, 2013 18:11:01 GMT
I think that is a great place to start.
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colonel wolfe
Junior Member
"I haven't done any research "-Steve Yune
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Post by colonel wolfe on Dec 12, 2013 21:29:46 GMT
The average robotech tactics investment was $270. people being disturbed by delays with it are going ti be about 18 times more upset than people upset over a $15 PDF...
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Post by ninjabunny on Dec 12, 2013 21:57:52 GMT
People with the robotech tactic have a right to be upset but I think the blame is going to be pointed at ninja division and palladium.
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Post by joshuagoliath on Dec 13, 2013 3:45:28 GMT
The real key to keeping Palladium alive: Put out material. On time. That people want
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Post by Sci-Fi on Dec 13, 2013 9:12:27 GMT
That'll sure help.  |
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colonel wolfe
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Post by colonel wolfe on Dec 13, 2013 16:38:24 GMT
The real key to keeping Palladium alive: Put out material. On time. That people want see, that flies in the face to Kevin's Logic thou... Not on time in last decade = Still alive.... Why should he even focus on putting anything besides the Rifter out on time... because a good percentage of his Fanatics believe wholeheartedly that "delays" = better product, and that any company that puts out books on time, obviously rushed and sacrificed quality for time-table. |
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Post by joshuagoliath on Dec 13, 2013 17:24:39 GMT
The real key to keeping Palladium alive: Put out material. On time. That people want see, that flies in the face to Kevin's Logic thou... Not on time in last decade = Still alive.... Why should he even focus on putting anything besides the Rifter out on time... because a good percentage of his Fanatics believe wholeheartedly that "delays" = better product, and that any company that puts out books on time, obviously rushed and sacrificed quality for time-table. Yes, well, my views on how Kevin runs the company, and his points of view in general, are well established. Creative genius doesn't always mesh well with the real world. |
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Post by damianmagecraft on Dec 13, 2013 19:40:10 GMT
The real key to keeping Palladium alive: Put out material. On time. That people want see, that flies in the face to Kevin's Logic thou... Not on time in last decade = Still alive.... Why should he even focus on putting anything besides the Rifter out on time... because a good percentage of his Fanatics believe wholeheartedly that "delays" = better product, and that any company that puts out books on time, obviously rushed and sacrificed quality for time-table. to be fair... On the few (rare) times pally has produced quickly the quality has suffered. |
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colonel wolfe
Junior Member
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Post by colonel wolfe on Dec 13, 2013 21:00:00 GMT
If I could be given some examples of this... like what book was one time and in what ways it's suffered. I have 2 robotech books that are years delayed that still were lacking.
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Post by damianmagecraft on Dec 13, 2013 21:09:42 GMT
If I could be given some examples of this... like what book was one time and in what ways it's suffered. I have 2 robotech books that are years delayed that still were lacking. I didn't say on time. I said quickly. As in a month after Kevin said "I am working on book x." |
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Post by ninjabunny on Dec 13, 2013 21:15:05 GMT
If I could be given some examples of this... like what book was one time and in what ways it's suffered. I have 2 robotech books that are years delayed that still were lacking. I didn't say on time. I said quickly. As in a month after Kevin said "I am working on book x." the only book I can think of is Kevin's dead reign & that book was all his fault. |
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Post by damianmagecraft on Dec 13, 2013 21:25:51 GMT
If you think any company produces on time you are fooling yourself. No book is done when they want it done.
The difference between them and pally is they don't talk about a project until it hits final edit. ( sometimes not even then).
Kevin otoh talks up projects before he has the first draft.
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Post by ninjabunny on Dec 13, 2013 21:30:51 GMT
That would be a sign of bad business practice by Kevin then.
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Post by damianmagecraft on Dec 13, 2013 21:40:41 GMT
That would be a sign of bad business practice by Kevin then. and its been pointed out to him for over 30 years. It is what it is. |
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colonel wolfe
Junior Member
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Posts: 160
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Post by colonel wolfe on Dec 13, 2013 21:52:45 GMT
The myth is delays = quality and on time = crap. I read it all the time about products by other companies.
Other companies may have delays. But rarely is it multi year promises of work on a book that's 90+% done.
Northern gun 1 may be awesome... but he promised it out in February 2012. Nearly 2 years later I'm just not interested. "
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Post by Sci-Fi on Dec 14, 2013 0:11:05 GMT
The real key to keeping Palladium alive: Put out material. On time. That people want see, that flies in the face to Kevin's Logic thou... Not on time in last decade = Still alive.... Why should he even focus on putting anything besides the Rifter out on time... because a good percentage of his Fanatics believe wholeheartedly that "delays" = better product, and that any company that puts out books on time, obviously rushed and sacrificed quality for time-table. The last two rifters were a month+ late. lol |
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colonel wolfe
Junior Member
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Posts: 160
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Post by colonel wolfe on Dec 14, 2013 0:43:34 GMT
see, that flies in the face to Kevin's Logic thou... Not on time in last decade = Still alive.... Why should he even focus on putting anything besides the Rifter out on time... because a good percentage of his Fanatics believe wholeheartedly that "delays" = better product, and that any company that puts out books on time, obviously rushed and sacrificed quality for time-table. The last two rifters were a month+ late. lol lol get back to me when one is a year late... |
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Post by joshuagoliath on Dec 14, 2013 2:48:13 GMT
It boils down to this: Kevin sees everything he does as uber-amazeballs, only asks opinions of those who will tell him what he wants to hear, and sees that nothing can possibly be wrong with how he does things, no matter what slaps him in the face.
Since he refuses to acknowledge any problems, NOTHING will change. Are there TONS of options available for him? Yes. Will he follow ANY of them? No, because in his mind, nothing is wrong, nothing can be wrong, and nothing will be wrong (except his naysayers).
There's an old expression about absolute power that comes to mind when talking about PB...
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Post by damianmagecraft on Dec 14, 2013 3:56:22 GMT
I can see why Kevin operates the way does...
I don't agree with it but I can understand it.
When he first started he did things everyone said would fail... But they didn't fail many of them proved to be greater successes than expected.
So of course he has continued in this vein ever since.
Forgetting apparently that you can't buck the odds forevet.
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Post by joshuagoliath on Dec 14, 2013 4:00:04 GMT
And also, apparently, failing to notice everything around him that proves he's now failing like people said all those years ago...
Your defense works if we were talking about PB slipping to like a #4 slot on the RPG list, but we're WELL beyond that. His "I've done it before" validation has expired years ago.
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Post by damianmagecraft on Dec 14, 2013 4:04:43 GMT
And also, apparently, failing to notice everything around him that proves he's now failing like people said all those years ago... Your defense works if we were talking about PB slipping to like a #4 slot on the RPG list, but we're WELL beyond that. His "I've done it before" validation has expired years ago. believe me I don't consider it a defense. Just an explanation of why he is working as he is. I think he should have abandoned it long ago. |
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Post by kryptt on Dec 14, 2013 8:42:02 GMT
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Post by damianmagecraft on Dec 14, 2013 10:38:51 GMT
you do know half of his sources have recanted publicly; right? |
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Post by ninjabunny on Dec 14, 2013 14:21:20 GMT
you do know half of his sources have recanted publicly; right? bill coffins recante was more on how he handled his anger. |
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Post by Jaymz on Dec 14, 2013 14:30:36 GMT
As i recall, that is correct. Bill recanted in the method/expression. Not on the actual content.
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