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Post by joshuagoliath on Apr 14, 2014 21:33:28 GMT
So, I've returned to working on my diabolist stuff.
Before I do, I need some input from players and GMs...
What are your problems with the OCC? What questions get raised when you read it? When you have a player try using it?
What are your biggest issues with how it's written?
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Post by Jaymz on Apr 15, 2014 13:25:19 GMT
Not being a fantasy guy, I haven't noticed anything per se that could be an issue.......no more so than most other magic or nothing a GM couldn't deal with.
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Post by damianmagecraft on Apr 15, 2014 18:29:52 GMT
Biggest issue I see brought up is can you carry prepared but un energized wards.
the threads on the FotM are rampant with flames on the matter.
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Post by Prysus on Apr 15, 2014 23:55:43 GMT
Greetings and Salutations. First, I've never played a Diabolist, run for one, and I don't foresee the situation ever coming up honestly. So I have no real opinion or stake on the matter. The points I bring up are just the ones I've seen discussed previously, and I don't care how they're resolved as long as they're addressed.
1: Damian mentioned one I had forgotten (but I do recall).
2: On the FB page I also mentioned the rune parchment paper issue (including armor).
3: Due to Damian's post, I'm also reminded of warding weapons debate. I remember this debate as well. One part says that it can't because every time it's moved it'll be set off, but just a bit later it says that the Diabolist can move warded objects without setting them off. That then connected to how if someone else touches it at the same time as the Diabolist that it won't go off, so you still couldn't use it as a weapon returned with how the Diabolist could activate a ward, and therefore could activate it as they hit (and the Diabolist is impervious to his own wards). I don't remember all the details, I just remember one of the many Diabolists debates.
Farewell and safe journeys for now. |
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Post by joshuagoliath on Apr 16, 2014 3:30:48 GMT
Thanks guys. I plan on addressing these issues and any others you bring up.
Im looking at two basic ideas. Either rewrite JUST the diabolist, or rewrite the diabolist and the summoner into one occ.
Thoughts?
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Post by Prysus on Apr 16, 2014 4:14:48 GMT
Thanks guys. I plan on addressing these issues and any others you bring up. Im looking at two basic ideas. Either rewrite JUST the diabolist, or rewrite the diabolist and the summoner into one occ. Thoughts? Greetings and Salutations. I once looked and couldn't find it, but I thought in the books somewhere it said that Summoners and Diabolists had once been a single O.C.C. Maybe that was just someone's theory, or maybe it was from one of our talks in the past (darn it, I can't even remember if I discussed the rest of this theory with you or not!). Anyways ...
In my mind (at some point), I came up with the story that in the past they were one O.C.C. However, with the Millennium of Purification and so much magic lost, this class and its knowledge was lost. The Summoner and Diabolist are a result of trying to rediscover this art from ages long since passed (through scraps of notes salvaged, etc.). So while there's some overlap (such as use of circles and magic symbols), it's two different O.C.C. now (a shadow of its former self). This helps to show how powerful magic could've been in the past, and just two pale versions of it in this day and age.
This also opens up the door for potential adventures/quests, further uncovering some of these lost secrets and/or trying to find a way to make these two O.C.C. one again, reclaiming their former glory. Just my thoughts. You asked, so there they are. Farewell and safe journeys for now. |
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Post by damianmagecraft on Apr 16, 2014 4:37:13 GMT
Thanks guys. I plan on addressing these issues and any others you bring up. Im looking at two basic ideas. Either rewrite JUST the diabolist, or rewrite the diabolist and the summoner into one occ. Thoughts? an interesting idea... But I actually prefer them kept separate. Each is unique (although the overlap in circle magic is an indication they may have been a single class at one time) and fills its own niche. |
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Post by joshuagoliath on Apr 16, 2014 7:21:48 GMT
*Runes and “paper armor”: Parchment is highly impractical as an armor. While some may argue that parchment is basically the same as leather, a few notes need to be made. When parchment is made, it is limed and stretched. The lime is a trigger that magically reacts with the silver runes. The tanning process for leather armor prevents the magic from making the same link. Once made into parchment, it is still stiff and unflexible, making the runic parchment armor idea completely unfeasible.
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Post by damianmagecraft on Apr 16, 2014 15:44:57 GMT
*Runes and “paper armor”: Parchment is highly impractical as an armor. While some may argue that parchment is basically the same as leather, a few notes need to be made. When parchment is made, it is limed and stretched. The lime is a trigger that magically reacts with the silver runes. The tanning process for leather armor prevents the magic from making the same link. Once made into parchment, it is still stiff and unflexible, making the runic parchment armor idea completely unfeasible. not arguing... but pointing out a commonly used counter point... layered armor. Oriental Paper armor is often brought up in the discussions. |
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Post by joshuagoliath on Apr 17, 2014 1:18:57 GMT
*Runes and “paper armor”: Parchment is highly impractical as an armor. While some may argue that parchment is basically the same as leather, a few notes need to be made. When parchment is made, it is limed and stretched. The lime is a trigger that magically reacts with the silver runes. The tanning process for leather armor prevents the magic from making the same link. Once made into parchment, it is still stiff and unflexible, making the runic parchment armor idea completely unfeasible. not arguing... but pointing out a commonly used counter point... layered armor. Oriental Paper armor is often brought up in the discussions. Yes, because people want to equate paper to parcjment... not the same though |
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Post by damianmagecraft on Apr 17, 2014 3:59:34 GMT
not arguing... but pointing out a commonly used counter point... layered armor. Oriental Paper armor is often brought up in the discussions. Yes, because people want to equate paper to parcjment... not the same though true enough but same process "could" conceivably be applied to Parchment. (not that I would allow it). My only issue with the re-write is your defining exactly why a silver rune renders the parchment indestructible. (I prefer the mystery surrounding it). |
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Post by djwolfdude on Apr 23, 2014 9:16:33 GMT
I used to play an Ogre Diabolist, named Pug the Mug. Ater reading and re-reading the class info, I saw an exploit. Carved dragonbone into the shape of the letters/words, stitched onto the skin with silver thread. Yes, it did permanent damage to Pug that he could not heal back BUT the wards were there for when he wanted them. I only allowed protection type wards to be used this way. Attack types still had to be put on one use paper or the like..... my two coppers on the subject....
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Post by joshuagoliath on Apr 23, 2014 15:26:26 GMT
I used to play an Ogre Diabolist, named Pug the Mug. Ater reading and re-reading the class info, I saw an exploit. Carved dragonbone into the shape of the letters/words, stitched onto the skin with silver thread. Yes, it did permanent damage to Pug that he could not heal back BUT the wards were there for when he wanted them. I only allowed protection type wards to be used this way. Attack types still had to be put on one use paper or the like..... my two coppers on the subject.... Silver thread: pointless Carved wards need to be made out of specific things. Dragonbone is not a "replace any other material" item. Only inflict or protwctions from (no protwction by infliction) work on people anyway. Exploit is not an exploit. In fact, it wouldnt even work. |
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Post by damianmagecraft on Apr 24, 2014 6:25:54 GMT
I used to play an Ogre Diabolist, named Pug the Mug. Ater reading and re-reading the class info, I saw an exploit. Carved dragonbone into the shape of the letters/words, stitched onto the skin with silver thread. Yes, it did permanent damage to Pug that he could not heal back BUT the wards were there for when he wanted them. I only allowed protection type wards to be used this way. Attack types still had to be put on one use paper or the like..... my two coppers on the subject.... Silver thread: pointless Carved wards need to be made out of specific things. Dragonbone is not a "replace any other material" item. Only inflict or protwctions from (no protwction by infliction) work on people anyway. Exploit is not an exploit. In fact, it wouldnt even work. Permanence Ward must be carved from Dragon or Demon Bone And can be stitched into skin IIRC (not going to dig out my books at this hour to confirm)... May be where he saw the "exploit." |
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Post by joshuagoliath on Apr 24, 2014 16:57:06 GMT
Silver thread: pointless Carved wards need to be made out of specific things. Dragonbone is not a "replace any other material" item. Only inflict or protwctions from (no protwction by infliction) work on people anyway. Exploit is not an exploit. In fact, it wouldnt even work. Permanence Ward must be carved from Dragon or Demon Bone And can be stitched into skin IIRC (not going to dig out my books at this hour to confirm)... May be where he saw the "exploit." Correct, but none of the other wards would work from that. They need their own components |
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Post by damianmagecraft on Apr 24, 2014 17:40:41 GMT
Permanence Ward must be carved from Dragon or Demon Bone And can be stitched into skin IIRC (not going to dig out my books at this hour to confirm)... May be where he saw the "exploit." Correct, but none of the other wards would work from that. They need their own components True that... Which has sent me thinking about a Diabolist/Tattoo Master hybrid class before... A character who makes magic Tats but... only with the Diabolists wards, symbols, and Runes... Granted the process is/should be just as likely to kill you as instil magic power... (odd thoughts you never know when or where they will take you). |
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